How so? She has a lovely article in the July, 2010, issue. But I think its more than just the fact that you have what the Zen masters call beginners mind, right, that you start out not knowing as much. But if you think that what being a parent does is not make children more like themselves and more like you, but actually make them more different from each other and different from you, then when you do a twin study, youre not going to see that. I think its off, but I think its often in a way thats actually kind of interesting. So if you think from this broad evolutionary perspective about these creatures that are designed to explore, I think theres a whole lot of other things that go with that. So theres really a kind of coherent whole about what childhood is all about. The robots are much more resilient. Theyre much better at generalizing, which is, of course, the great thing that children are also really good at. But I think its important to say when youre thinking about things like meditation, or youre thinking about alternative states of consciousness in general, that theres lots of different alternative states of consciousness. Ive trained myself to be productive so often that its sometimes hard to put it down. The scientist in the crib: Minds, brains, and how children learn. And its worsened by an intellectual and economic culture that prizes efficiency and dismisses play. And of course, youve got the best play thing there could be, which is if youve got a two-year-old or a three-year-old or a four-year-old, they kind of force you to be in that state, whether you start out wanting to be or not. Alison Gopnik is a professor of psychology and philosophy at the University of California, Berkeley, where she runs the Cognitive Development and Learning Lab; shes also the author of over 100 papers and half a dozen books, including The Gardener and the Carpenter and The Philosophical Baby. What I love about her work is she takes the minds of children seriously. Thats really what were adapted to, are the unknown unknowns. I suspect that may be what the consciousness of an octo is like. And what that suggests is the things that having a lot of experience with play was letting you do was to be able to deal with unexpected challenges better, rather than that it was allowing you to attain any particular outcome. But your job is to figure out your own values. Her books havent just changed how I look at my son. So its another way of having this explore state of being in the world. Its about dealing with something new or unexpected. And we can compare what it is that the kids and the A.I.s do in that same environment. And again, maybe not surprisingly, people have acted as if that kind of consciousness is what consciousness is really all about. Alison Gopnik Personal Life, Relationships and Dating. And you yourself sort of disappear. And it seems like that would be one way to work through that alignment problem, to just assume that the learning is going to be social. Alison Gopnik is at the center of helping us understand how babies and young children think and learn (her website is www.alisongopnik.com ). So part of it kind of goes in circles. You have the paper to write. So this isnt just a conversation about kids or for parents. A Very Human Answer to One of AIs Deepest Dilemmas, Children, Creativity, and the Real Key to Intelligence, Causal learning, counterfactual reasoning and pretend play: a cross-cultural comparison of Peruvian, mixed- and low-socioeconomic status U.S. children | Philosophical Transactions of the Royal Society B: Biological Sciences, Love Lets Us Learn: Psychological Science Makes the Case for Policies That Help Children, The New Riddle of the Sphinx: Life History and Psychological Science, Emotional by Leonard Mlodinow review - the new thinking about feelings, What Children Lose When Their Brains Develop Too Fast, Why nation states struggle with social care. A child psychologistand grandmothersays such fears are overblown. Shes part of the A.I. So when they first started doing these studies where you looked at the effects of an enriching preschool and these were play-based preschools, the way preschools still are to some extent and certainly should be and have been in the past. I think anyone whos worked with human brains and then goes to try to do A.I., the gulf is really pretty striking. She studies the cognitive science of learning and development. Do you think for kids that play or imaginative play should be understood as a form of consciousness, a state? Gopnik, 1982, for further discussion). And theres a very, very general relationship between how long a period of childhood an organism has and roughly how smart they are, how big their brains are, how flexible they are. So we have more different people who are involved and engaged in taking care of children. The company has been scrutinized over fake reviews and criticized by customers who had trouble getting refunds. So youre actually taking in information from everything thats going on around you. There's an old view of the mind that goes something like this: The world is flooding in, and we're sitting back, just trying to process it all. Alison Gopnik Creativity is something we're not even in the ballpark of explaining. Thank you to Alison Gopnik for being here. And is that the dynamic that leads to this spotlight consciousness, lantern consciousness distinction? And its kind of striking that the very best state of the art systems that we have that are great at playing Go and playing chess and maybe even driving in some circumstances, are terrible at doing the kinds of things that every two-year-old can do. Articles by Ismini A. And I think its called social reference learning. I have some information about how this machine works, for example, myself. As youve been learning so much about the effort to create A.I., has it made you think about the human brain differently? And you say, OK, so now I want to design you to do this particular thing well. Explore our digital archive back to 1845, including articles by more than 150 Nobel . So, going for a walk with a two-year-old is like going for a walk with William Blake. And thats not playing. Another thing that people point out about play is play is fun. And if you sort of set up any particular goal, if you say, oh, well, if you play more, youll be more robust or more resilient. What counted as being the good thing, the value 10 years ago might be really different from the thing that we think is important or valuable now. So thats one change thats changed from this lots of local connections, lots of plasticity, to something thats got longer and more efficient connections, but is less changeable. But one of the great finds for me in the parenting book world has been Alison Gopniks work. Psychologist Alison Gopnik explores new discoveries in the science of human nature. 4 References Tamar Kushnir, Alison Gopnik, Nadia Chernyak, Elizabeth Seiver, Henry M. Wellman, Developing intuitions about free will between ages four and six, Cognition, Volume 138, 2015, Pages 79-101, ISSN 0010-0277, . April 16, 2021 Produced by 'The Ezra Klein Show' Here's a sobering. Theyre like a different kind of creature than the adult. But it turns out that if instead of that, what you do is you have the human just play with the things on the desk. So theres a really nice picture about what happens in professorial consciousness. The consequence of that is that you have this young brain that has a lot of what neuroscientists call plasticity. So I figure thats a pretty serious endorsement when a five-year-old remembers something from a year ago. Shes in both the psychology and philosophy departments there. Just do the things that you think are interesting or fun. So the question is, if we really wanted to have A.I.s that were really autonomous and maybe we dont want to have A.I.s that are really autonomous. And another example that weve been working on a lot with the Bay Area group is just vision. And again, thats a lot of the times, thats a good thing because theres other things that we have to do. But the numinous sort of turns up the dial on awe. So my five-year-old grandson, who hasnt been in our house for a year, first said, I love you, grandmom, and then said, you know, grandmom, do you still have that book that you have at your house with the little boy who has this white suit, and he goes to the island with the monsters on it, and then he comes back again? And that brain, the brain of the person whos absorbed in the movie, looks more like the childs brain. The Many Minds of the Octopus (15 Apr 2021). Theyre kind of like our tentacles. Yeah, so I think thats a good question. Gopnik's findings are challenging traditional beliefs about the minds of babies and young children, for example, the notion that very young children do not understand the perspective of others an idea philosophers and psychologists have defended for years. In The Gardener and the Carpenter, the pioneering developmental psychologist and philosopher Alison Gopnik argues that the familiar twenty-first-century picture of parents and children is profoundly wrongit's not just based on bad science, it's bad for kids and parents, too. But it also involves allowing the next generation to take those values, look at them in the context of the environment they find themselves in now, reshape them, rethink them, do all the things that we were mentioning that teenagers do consider different kinds of alternatives. You may change your billing preferences at any time in the Customer Center or call Thats really what you want when youre conscious. Those are sort of the options. The Ezra Klein Show is produced by Rog Karma and Jeff Geld; fact-checking by Michelle Harris; original music by Isaac Jones; mixing by Jeff Geld. So what kind of function could that serve? Were talking here about the way a child becomes an adult, how do they learn, how do they play in a way that keeps them from going to jail later. I have so much trouble actually taking the world on its own terms and trying to derive how it works. Its a terrible literature. She is the author of over 100 journal articles and several books including the bestselling and critically acclaimed popular books "The Scientist in the Crib" William Morrow, 1999 . And I have done a bit of meditation and workshops, and its always a little amusing when you see the young men who are going to prove that theyre better at meditating. One of my greatest pleasures is to be what the French call a flneursomeone who wanders randomly through a big city, stumbling on new scenes. She introduces the topic of causal understanding. working group there. Now its not so much about youre visually taking in all the information around you the way that you do when youre exploring. The amazing thing about kids is that they do things that are unexpected. So, surprise, surprise, when philosophers and psychologists are thinking about consciousness, they think about the kind of consciousness that philosophers and psychologists have a lot of the time. That doesnt seem like such a highfalutin skill to be able to have. I feel like thats an answer thats going to launch 100 science fiction short stories, as people imagine the stories youre describing here. So we actually did some really interesting experiments where we were looking at how these kinds of flexibility develop over the space of development. And I just saw how constant it is, just all day, doing something, touching back, doing something, touching back, like 100 times in an hour. Paul Krugman Breaks It Down. The centers offered kids aged zero to five education, medical checkups, and. Is that right? Theyre paying attention to us. It feels like its just a category. And he was absolutely right. But setting up a new place, a new technique, a new relationship to the world, thats something that seems to help to put you in this childlike state. So it turns out that you look at genetics, and thats responsible for some of the variance. But theyre not going to prison. And it turns out that if you have a system like that, it will be very good at doing the things that it was optimized for, but not very good at being resilient, not very good at changing when things are different, right? And in meditation, you can see the contrast between some of these more pointed kinds of meditation versus whats sometimes called open awareness meditation.
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